Open Challenge to Ellis (Part 2)

[garnabby]

So, you banned me from your own forum for some unknown reason. I can only assume because your mind thinks I'm selling something so I must be the enemy I guess. Nope, I don't sell anything. I'm just a baccarat player who learns something every day that I play.

You were banned after another of your "nutty" posts at, Baccarat system - www.RouletteForum.net Roulette System Forum , when "the jig" was just about up. (One can only get so much out of a "sucker".)

Then you tried to get back onto my own (private and non-profit) board under the username "adsbuddy", for more nonsense, but still i was able to make some very-good baccarat points out of it... maybe it's time to be banned again, lol.

The laughs just keep rolling in from the "Beaten by the Casino (even before getting there)" group.

[ADulay]

Garn,

I see where you've used that particular link to "show" that I deserved to be banned in several threads but I think the concensus opinion of that thread was that there was something obviously wrong with YOU, and that's not my opinion!

That's from the thread moderator AND the forum administrator!!

I don't think I'd use that thread to support your claims at all.

Oh yeah, I'm still not Aegis, like you continue to say.

AD (this IS fun!)

[garnabby]

AD (this IS fun!)

Acting like a complete idiot/liar is fun? Being banned is fun?

Is that what you guys call "getting your money's worth"? In that case, it's well worth the $50... even the old $500, and the old slicker board.

But Mike won't "oblige" any of youze here, lol. Just the facts.

[garnabby]

I have answered every single one of your questions.

Not a single one. Eg, which university did Ellis graduate from, as he claims from "an institution of higher learning" in the States; and which degree?

Should be an easy answer, right... unless it, like EVERYTHING else, is a pure lie.

Why do I have two user names? Would it be to maintain an element of fairness in posting so that it doesn't appear that I have any conflict of interest? Nah, that would make too much sense.

You have that backwards, don't you... we should've been informed of such a "conflict of interest", and from the very beginning.

[ADulay]

Garnabby. (I looked it up in the dictionary. It said "incorrigible").

Anyway, I believe even Ellis answered your question several times, but you had never heard of SUNY. It's a standard name for the State University of New York. Even the kids on the short bus know that.

Anyway, I've wasted entirely too much time on this today.

What else would you like to know? Anyone reading this never ending saga of a desperate person pleading for attention has probably left by now so you can write and rant to whomever is left.

I've answered a question in another thread and thankfully, you haven't intruded on it yet, so it's still comprehensible to a normal person.

Enjoy this thread. It's all yours. Feel free to use my name in vain and make up whatever you want now. Nobody will care.

AD (banned by Garnabby. I'm so ashamed).


NOT!

[garnabby]

Yes, to all you "young" guys out there, the game gets beat everytime i sit down, and have pit crews gathering to see what i'm doing. A good system of an approach is hard to teach sometimes, and i credit Ellis for even trying to get through to some of the knuckleheads out there.

Sorry kolokotronis,

Like so many other Ellis's before yourself, you talk a lot while showing/proving NOTHING... not even a single scrap of anything real.

Not too surprising that you always win too. Whatever makes YOU feel good, i guess.

Can't tell us even one thing Ellis taught you (, other than the bullsh*t)? Would love to be able to respond to something like that, instead of all the desperate BTC-stuff.

[garnabby]

Anyway, I believe even Ellis answered your question several times, but you had never heard of SUNY. It's a standard name for the State University of New York. Even the kids on the short bus know that.

That institution never heard of him... email it yourself.

But which degree in which year... then i could perform a more-thorough check, in case that school is the wrong one.

Not to mention his PhD's, and sponsers then... given he also claims he was a professor of both physics and math, a de facto impossibility(?).

And his claims to have had a bursary set up for a deceased daughter somewhere, lol... who else would "sh*t on" people like that to scam a few more kind-hearted, but misguided persons?

[garnabby]

AD,

While you're still here, lol, you never answered why you use a "negative betting progression" (which isn't really a progression, after all that round-about "net-betting" stuff) if you can win 19 of 20 anything... instead of, say a 5-step standard positive progression?

[ADulay]

Then you tried to get back onto my own (private and non-profit) board under the username "adsbuddy", for more nonsense, but still i was able to make some very-good baccarat points out of it... maybe it's time to be banned again, lol.

Garn,

Just got a call from my lady friend who said you banned her from your baccarat site!! Now you ban people because they know me! Wow! I must really carry some weight.

Oh yeah, that's right, you just ban anybody who actually PLAYS the game.

I told her to go set up an account over there after describing you and your actions and she just couldn't believe it. I gave her those "clues" to login and she went in. Pretty intelligent lady. Plays a mean game of blackjack too! She was just amazed at your gross stupidity and total lack of sense with regards to gaming. She called up pretty much laughing and then told me of the ban.

Well done. Why not just ban anybody who attempts to sign up over there???

Anyway, just thought I'd drop this in so you'd know we both got a good chuckle out of it.

Ban away!!

AD

[garnabby]

AD,

You're still here, lol, and 0 for 2.

And you want to quit ("the thread") already... wonder how long you'd last at "the tables"????? THE $10-TABLES YET, LOL.

[garnabby]

Garn,

Just got a call from my lady friend who said you banned her from your baccarat site!! Now you ban people because they know me! Wow! I must really carry some weight.

Oh yeah, that's right, you just ban anybody who actually PLAYS the game.

I told her to go set up an account over there after describing you and your actions and she just couldn't believe it. I gave her those "clues" to login and she went in. Pretty intelligent lady. Plays a mean game of blackjack too! She was just amazed at your gross stupidity and total lack of sense with regards to gaming. She called up pretty much laughing and then told me of the ban.

Well done. Why not just ban anybody who attempts to sign up over there???

Anyway, just thought I'd drop this in so you'd know we both got a good chuckle out of it.

Ban away!!

AD

That's makes you a woman(?) then, with the same IP/ISP. (Or can't you fugure out which sex you are?)

0 for 3... .

[garnabby]

ZERO FOR THREE... .

You ought to rename it to "Beaten by the free forums everytime"?

[Ellis]

The only negative effect you've had on any forum Garnabby is this one. You are why it has so few members. Now it has one less. No point being on a forum you are out to destroy. No point for anyone.

[Archer]

Except Archer, my players win while you continue to lose. That's pretty damn hard to get around isn't it. But I know you will try.

BTW, I think most here will vouch that I have contributed quite a bit whereas I will challenge you to find a single post where you have contributed anything whatsoever other than rants and jealous rages. Perhaps you simply have nothing to offer. Losers always resort to name calling sooner or later just as you have done. Thats what they do when they can't answer the questions put forth to them. You can't put forth a single thing in your defense. No trip reports. Absolutely nothing. Many have seen me win. Many have played with me. You play in the dark, if at all. There must be a reason for that. One thing about scammers, nobody ever sees them play. Everybody has seen me play including your cohort Garnabby. Nobody has ever seen YOU play or him. Why don't you both come down here and play ME. Let's settle it once and for all. Put your money where your mouth is for once. But no, you two both always have some lame excuse everyone sees right straight through. I say neither of you could play your way out of a wet paper bag. Bac or BJ. So there it is again. Prove me wrong. Otherwise forever shut the hell up! You two are a complete waste of time. All name calling but no action.

ZZZZZZZZZZ seems like you are the one that is ranting Ellis. Try as hard as you like but you will not get me off the subject. I just called you a BS'er. Not any other names. I am voicing my opinion about Baccarat while you continue to ignore my questions and go into some ridiculous tirade as above. Sorry you can't stay on point and have a discussion. I guess your rants and challenges are a way to change the subject.

I also don't like the fact that you continue on this free site looking for money but continually say you are leaving. If you want to teach, teach. None of this baloney that the Forum is not set up to teach methods. I wonder if anyone remembers a few months back on BTC where you were "threatening" to raise the subscription price to $1,000.00. This was during the time when you were coming out with a new system a week and had a bunch of new public forum members. But I guess nobody bit since you forgot about that but then tried another tactic of $50.00 a month. The old bait and switch.

A

[Archer]

Archer,
for your education, why don't you meet me down in Lake Charles, LA just East of Houston at the Lauberge Du Lac Casino this Sat., 2/20?? I'll introduce you to my method of play...involves 4 systems in concert till about mid shoe. I wait till midshoe to pickup on game type and that's where some discretion comes into play. I avg. 8 units per. and feel resistance in the low to mid teens, but my losing shoe is -1 or -2. My method looks complex from a birds eye view, and the "staff" gather cause my score card looks like a page from Diff. equations and i'm usually the last man standing after a "tough" shoe. There are about 8 Bac tables, booked up due to the large Asian population in SE Texas. I'll be one of the few Caucasians. That's how you'll spot me.
Now for your entertainment, i want to let you know that i was in Vegas during the Thanks Giving week, my in-laws have a time share at the Planet Hollywood. I played the electronic game at Bellagio. As players left in disgust, mumbling "unbeatable", i did slightly better than my Avg. And the game moves fast without much time to think.
One guy there was trying to influence the players figuring he could outsmart the random generator, and suguested we all bet heavy on one side only to "tilt" the machine. Shows you there are very few pros in the game. The peculiar Asian girl next to me, who kept scribling in her pocket size note book, could only break even at best. Her half drunk boyfriend, impressed with her game, was trying to drag her into the high limit and promised to finance her with big bucks. Very few pros in the game....

Thanks for the invite but a little short notice for me. I read now that they were gathering to look at your unusual scorecard and not because you were winning. That makes a little more sense. I didn't mean to offend you. I play a lot of Baccarat so I realize that pit critters don't give a hoot who is winning and who is not. They care about cheating mostly.

Archer

[Ellis]

I haven't seen any Baccarat questions of your's to answer Archer. They are all about purposefully distorted slants on what and how I teach and aren't actual questions at all -just your way of name calling. Ask a Baccarat question and, if I think its worth answering, I will.

But I've got one for you. On my public forum after you finally finished ridiculing everything and everybody while having no idea of what we teach in the private forum, you said you had a flat bet system that worked that involved advantage betting. Well, we are still waiting???

The last question put to you was: When you are flat betting in Baccarat, what is this "advantage bet" you speak of? You couldn't seem to answer then. Can you answer now? Or suddenly you have no memory -again?

[Archer]

I haven't seen any Baccarat questions of your's to answer Archer. They are all about purposefully distorted slants on what and how I teach and aren't actual questions at all -just your way of name calling. Ask a Baccarat question and, if I think its worth answering, I will.

But I've got one for you. On my public forum after you finally finished ridiculing everything and everybody while having no idea of what we teach in the private forum, you said you had a flat bet system that worked that involved advantage betting. Well, we are still waiting???

The last question put to you was: When you are flat betting in Baccarat, what is this "advantage bet" you speak of? You couldn't seem to answer then. Can you answer now? Or suddenly you have no memory -again?

What do you mean again? I am not purposefully slanting anything Ellis. I also am not going to respond to the above innuendos. It's just another Ellis tactic to NOT talk about Baccarat. I am happy to answer any questions you may have in a straight forward manner. I wish you would do the same. You make contradictory statements all the time. But - to your question.

Yes, I have a flat bet advantage method. I have stated this on this forum. What's the big deal. It gets approximately 2% advantage
through documented testing. About 1.5- 2 units a shoe. It is difficult to play, easy to make simple mistakes, requires a lot of "focus" and therefore is tiring. It is very boring and has only a 65% shoe win ratio. So I really don't like it - I don't sell it and I have no interest in giving it out. One reason is that I already know that few will bother to take the time to learn it! Hope that is clear enough!

Look, dude, you yourself have stated that you know a player who flat bets and wins about 10 units a shoe for many years! Frankly I find that difficult to believe but. . . taking it at face value why do you seem so surprised from my statement? Then you turn around and emphatically say that the ONLY way to win is to pay you 500 bucks! (This $50.00 a month thing is just a hook and you know it. You have no intention of teaching people for 50 bucks!)

Do you see the problem, Ellis? In order for you to make money selling your non-system systems you cannot agree that other people can win too. If you admit that then you are basically giving folks no reason to pay you.

Ellis, if you would pay attention to my posts you would already know that I haven't called anybody a liar about what they do or don't win. In general I don't go there. Reason is it can't be proved either way and you never know when someone is embellishing.

I understand that people win at this game. I don't post my results or how I play for a good reason. Why should I and what difference does it make anyway? I could be BSing or not - who is to know? Who cares? Every winner here has their own way of playing. Unless there is a clear mathematical advantage the only way to win is to guess correctly; use MM and discipline. Sure, it is important to study the game, understand relationships, etc. etc.

I haven't knocked your systems either. People on your own private forum have sent me a few of them. You have a real good head for the game and your input is a valuable asset to this forum EXCEPT when you start in with the crazy talk! The casinos rig the cards, change the shoe to produce chop or streak at will, the game is not mathematical it is statistical, etc. etc.

My interest is theory. There are lots of ways to skin a cat! You say the ONLY way to win is YOUR way and everybody must pay $500.00 to find out.

If you want to shut me up that is easy! Stop the sales pitch and teach Baccarat!

Archer

[Ellis]

I asked the question (for the third time) because I was interested, but never mind.

[garnabby]

I asked the question (for the third time) because I was interested, but never mind.

Ellis/ADulay/John/and the other clones & shills of,



"Second verse... same as the first!" Great, time to work on our tax-returns tonight.

Maybe you don't report your income? Anyway, the IRS shouldn't care about a few $10 here or there... especially when the casinos will get it there.

[Ellis]

I see why you're so insanely jealous of high IQs. You obviously got short changed.

[Archer]

I haven't seen any Baccarat questions of your's to answer Archer. They are all about purposefully distorted slants on what and how I teach and aren't actual questions at all -just your way of name calling. Ask a Baccarat question and, if I think its worth answering, I will.

But I've got one for you. On my public forum after you finally finished ridiculing everything and everybody while having no idea of what we teach in the private forum, you said you had a flat bet system that worked that involved advantage betting. Well, we are still waiting???

The last question put to you was: When you are flat betting in Baccarat, what is this "advantage bet" you speak of? You couldn't seem to answer then. Can you answer now? Or suddenly you have no memory -again?

Relax Ellis. Understand that I don't sit around all day in a retirement community in the sticks of Arkansas on the computer attempting to get people to send me 500 bucks. I have a life.

There are several advantage bets on both P and B that we have found to win more than they lose. They were based on a fairly complicated pattern count. To explain them would be more trouble then they are worth to play. As I already said I don't give them out. I stated why. That is my choice. I don't even play them myself so why should I give them out. I think there are better ways.

Anyway you are starting to bore me with your whole hyped up sales pitch. For starters why don't you list the 33 books you brag that you wrote and make me eat my words

A

[Ellis]

It must be contagious. Great contributions to the cause guys,

[Archer]

It must be contagious. Great contributions to the cause guys,

LOL - Ellis' cause. That's the problem Ellis. After 465 posts the cause for you is to move people from here to your pocketbook!

As you can easily see when people are not trying to SELL anything they get treated with respect.

Winning at Baccarat is hard! You've made millions at it as you implied in your introduction to Twister when you stated "my first million." Stop pretending you are going to leave this forum and teach. that is MY challenge.

A>>>----------------------->

[Ellis]

It occurs to me that neither of you ever post anything to do with the furtherment of Baccarat knowledge. You both seem to be hopelessly hung up on me for some strange reason. I think my posts on this forum surpassed the meager extent of your combined Baccarat knowledge a long time ago. For some reason this seems to enrage the two of you like little third graders going after the smartest kid in the class. They are just third graders who don't know any better. Eventually most graduate out of third grade. MOST, but not all.

Instead of expending all your energy on your extremely obvious and juvenile Let's Stump Ellis questions, why don't you try expanding on the ideas and concepts I have put forth here. I think you both realize that the approach I am advocating is the only winning approach there is. I think enough players using my approach successfully have already posted here. Instead of ridiculously calling all of them liars, why not try improving on their winning tactics.

The casinos are highly organized in their efforts to beat us. And they do so easily because the players lack equal organization. The players are too busy tearing each other up to ever pose a threat to the casinos. Guys like you two see to that because you simply can't grasp the big picture. Why don't you try joining us instead of constantly making fools of yourselves and doing the bidding of the casinos for them? Who knows, you might even surprise everyone and come up with some good ideas of your own.

Doesn't that make better sense than ridiculing everyone else's ideas?

[Ellis]

And what is this ridiculous hang up you two guys have over me getting paid, such as it is, for my work. Don't you two get paid for your work? Does it occur to either of you that is why I can afford to make 464 posts. Which you chastize me for as if that were a bad thing.

The casinos have highly paid professionals working out their tactics for them. What do the players have? Our books are crap. The internet is crap. The very meager pay I get affords me the ability to put in the thousands of hours of research our side so desparately needs.

The casinos have tons of empirical data with the sharpests minds in the business pouring over it dailly. What have we got? Well I hate to lay this on you but you've got me and a handful of unpaid part timers. That's all she wrote. Or, of course, you could have the likes of Garnabby and Archer teaching you. How's that working out for you so far?

[Archer]

And what is this ridiculous hang up you two guys have over me getting paid, such as it is, for my work. Don't you two get paid for your work? Does it occur to either of you that is why I can afford to make 464 posts. Which you chastize me for as if that were a bad thing.

The casinos have highly paid professionals working out their tactics for them. What do the players have? Our books are crap. The internet is crap. The very meager pay I get affords me the ability to put in the thousands of hours of research our side so desparately needs.

The casinos have tons of empirical data with the sharpests minds in the business pouring over it dailly. What have we got? Well I hate to lay this on you but you've got me and a handful of unpaid part timers. That's all she wrote. Or, of course, you could have the likes of Garnabby and Archer teaching you. How's that working out for you so far?

For a guy who complains about name calling you sure do a LOT of it Ellis!

First, you are not teaching Ellis, you are selling. Your posts here do NOT afford most much valuable information. They are mostly just come ons. You talk net betting, picking tables, etc. - so what. So now you say you don't want to teach without getting paid. Okay, your choice. But don't pretend you are here teaching - that's all.

I have no objection to you wanting to have a Baccarat "school." People can sign up as they choose and apparetnly you are allowed to use this forum as an advertising format. That is up to Mike. So advertise and be done with it OR teach something. Teach table selection, whatever, I don't care what.

It's the baloney I object to. The recent baloney I noticed was your comments that if you pick a table and are losing then you've "made a mistake." So I guess you try to pick again and see if you win or not or leave the table. Well, if you win you didn't make a mistake, LOL. That's real convenient for you isn't it? It's NOT your strategy that fails - IT'S THE PLAYER WHO SCREWS UP!!!!

That is just one example of the multitude of shear hype that you deploy.

Archer >>>------------------->