Otb4l and tb4l switches

[Ellis]

Oddsman, all I can tell you is I keep hearing bad things but I haven't heard that paricular complaint before. Go after him!

[fulkgl]

so sorry for posting even though it's not the right place. I just want to ask if anyone knows if the site of Lee Jones system is real or not? I paid 300 and didn't get anything.

You are talking about his "predictor system"? His web site has been sitting online without change for several years. I downloaded his free trial and have run my 169 saved shoes through his program. The results are not good. Overall -2.57%roi. In theory baccarat should be around -1.2%roi for a random pick. All 4 pick methods (bank, player, vertical, jump) came out negative for me. Granted 169 shoes is not enough size to make firm conclusions. I saw 65-104 winning shoes to losers.

[oddsman]

I just ordered it hours ago, maybe I would get a reply, he suppose to give a password to enter his site for info. I paid thruough paypal, they have a procedure where they give you the money back in case of dispute. I will wait till Monday

[drektek]

Hey ellis your saying your just finishing teaching where do you teach these systems online.

I would be very interested in learning a solid baccart system, i have lost probably around 5k overall over 2-3 years betting baccarat.

I have been betting sports for the last 3 years and have what i believe to be a winning edge in the sport. Maybe we can help each other feel free to pm me.

[oddsman]

Just to follow up on my posts... Lee Jones did send me after maybe 5 hours, the login password to the memebers' area of his system site.

[Ellis]

Drektek, my site is beatthecasino.com . I charge $50 a month which for some strange reason irks a couple of the members here. Purely mechanical systems are break even at best. I teach approaches and have been doing so successfully for 25 years. I put my money where my mouth is and play right along side my students. We frequenty post winning group and student trip reports which also irks a couple guys here. They say all my students lie. And they say the many players from this forum who join my forum somehow become liars overnight. I think they are just jealous that they can't figure out themselves how to beat this game and never will. Wrong attitude. Enough from me. I'll let one of my students tell you himself. I got the following post yesterday:

"I just played 30 shoes over the last 8 days in over 4 different casinos. 100% win rate! Avg of 12+ units net per shoe. I'm up 1,000+ units and I'm only betting green.

I did it using the systems learned on the full member site, at BTC and you only need to know 4 things to achieve it.

Here are the 4.

1. Bet placement. Where to place your bet.
2. Bet progression. How much to bet, and when.
3. Proper Bank Roll
4. Discipline.

The first two, Bet Placement and Bet Progression, you can learn easily right here on the full BTC forum. I'll outline exactly how I played on a post in the full forum, and the best part is that its 90% mechanical.

And the good news is that by learning the first two, you can easily make #3 on the list.

#4 is totally up to you. Its what will put you in the 1% that consistently beats this game. The good news is that with what you learn here, mainly #1 and #2, you can develop #4.

Why? Because as you see that these approaches work, you develop confidence in your sense of play. This is very important as...

Confidence... breeds ... Competence

and

Competence... breeds... Results.

and with Results, you acquire what I can only call.... Faith.

This Faith, gives you the discipline to succeed. Faith in the systems that you worked so hard to learn will pay off.

This Faith will help you to have the discipline to stay the course, to NOT get emotioanl when you play, to NOT go 'ALL IN' just because you lost a few bets, to pause and look at what the shoe is telling you.


I have never won this consistently before in my life.

I'll outline exactly how I play on the full site.

I'll answer any questions you have as soon as I can, but I'm about to travel, and I do play full time.

Hope to see you on the full forum soon and welcome you to the 1% club! I and the rest of the students will give you all the help you need.

Mark T."

How could I add to that? Mark, joined two years ago and became a full time player one year ago.

Hey oddsman, once you figure out you got scammed come join us.

[PoFoMoFo]

what is otb4l and tb4l??

[lawrenceshere]

This is my experience with OTBL and TBL.

In alot of shoes, a 4th jump streak averages at around 2-5. If you meet a streak like that, you will have lost 4 unit bets. For example, you get 2 of these streaks, you will need at least 8 OTBL streaks to break even. I find that not happening often as we will be waiting for 2 in a rows before betting. And by that time, the shoe will end making you red.

The only method to win is through:

1. Money Management. (Very important)
2. A very small stop-win
3. Lots of luck!!!

Just play normally and leave if you are down for like 4-5 in a row. Progression only if you are in a winning streak. Play small units as it will not give you a heart attack if you lose. Just enjoy the game.

I have tried lots of strategy but I find it to be of no use. Surely there are some that can better your odds but I have not find any yet.

BTW, Mr Ellis, even though I do not believe about strategies for this game of chance, your post have gven me alot of insights which actually did help me better my game. I actually now look for breaks of trends and bet accordingly.

I think this forum has alot of great members. Keep up the good work. Cheers.

[Ellis]

Good post Lawrence! The whole secret of playing OTB4L successfully is knowing the BEST time to jump on both straight and ZZ runs. You can't "standardize" on this. You must do what is best for the shoe you are playing right now. You must know what is LC (Least Common) in the shoe you are playing right now. For instance if 3s are occurring more than normal, you don't want to be found betting that 3s will go to 4 because that is NOT what is happening in YOUR shoe. When 3s are MC (most common) you want to be betting that 3s stay 3 by going two bets on opposites before you go on repeats. You need to be doing this on both straight and ZZ runs. We have a count for this called an SAP count but you can get pretty darn close by carefully observing what is happening in the shoe you are playing. No, you won't always be right but that is not the object. The object is to be right MOST of the time. If you always go on the runs that are LC, you will be right most of the time. Will you always win? No but you will usually win and you avoid catastrophic losses because you are never found betting against the MC. THAT is what causes big losses. So you are optimizing your wins while minimizing your losses. That is the best way to win overall.