Thread: Banned again, part 1...

Wow, Ellis opened up his forum to my IP-address again after a "lifetime" ban on it, (and "someone's" posted threats of legal action against myself should i continue posting at BTC.) Of course i re-registered as "garnabby" not to appear evasive. Here's the "exchange" copied & pasted best as i could keep up, given the constant shuffling of posts over there. I wonder... did he take another whole thread down over there?

First, the invitation:

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08-15-2009, 05:43 AM #1 (permalink) giselle knowles

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Casino orcastration is a Mith

Theres no such thing as casino orchestration in the baccarat game,when i say this i mean in shuffling, sure theres casino orc in things like comps and all the nice dealers and pit bosses who want to keep you at the table as long as possible,the fact you can eat and drink at the table is proof enough, fact is the longer you sit there the happier the casinos are....

As far as the casino orc Mith in shuffling is concerned it was never proven, theres a few that say why did the casinos take rise over the yrs ,like all conspiracy Theorists they always start there sentence with a question...

The casino take went up over the yrs because of many reasons but the way the cards where shuffled was not one of them, the answer lies in the players themselves.

08-17-2009, 07:01 AM #2 (permalink) E. Clifton Davis
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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith

Right and the Vegas casino Baccarat table take rate went from a published 3% to a published 26% because the players got 900% worse. I'm beginning to think you work for the casinos. Hell you can't even spell orchestration or myth. Keep believing that. No wonder you are losing. You seem to have it confused with castration. Maybe you've got a fixation.
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Last edited by E. Clifton Davis; 08-17-2009 at 07:04 AM.


08-17-2009, 04:13 PM #3 (permalink) giselle knowles

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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith

Wynn's abnormal lucky streak baffles analysts - MarketWatch
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/07/25/bu...pagewanted=all
http://www.lvrj.com/news/35952509.html
http://www.gamblingcompliance.com/node/23998
http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache...&ct=clnk&gl=uk
http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2009...ch-hard-times/

from just these few articles on baccarat table take rate shows there is many factors that are taken into account,and these rates vary from casino to casino and from year to year, isnt learning great !!!


08-18-2009, 09:40 AM #4 (permalink) E. Clifton Davis
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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith

I read the Wynn article when it first came out. I don't know why you would post it. It goes a long way to prove my point and discredit yours. Of course if you have a closed mind you can make anything prove anything in your head.

Anyone who has played as long as I have knows casino orchestration is alive and well. If it weren't the casinos would have gone broke a long time ago.

In Baccarat the 20 in a rows we used to see daily have completely disappeared. Even 12 and 15 in a rows are not nearly as common as they used to be. I've had two 20 in a rows in the same shoe.

But casinos realize that they are only at risk in long runs. So they eliminated them and thus eliminated their main source of risk.

In BJ we caught them using the Bahama hole card trick many times. (the dealer turns his highest card up instead of his first card) You CAN'T beat such a game. It changes the odds 14% in the casino's favor. The pit boss at Caesars Vegas admitted to it when we caught them red handed. He told us he teaches ALL his dealers to do that. The Casino Mgr. made him give everyone their buy in back.

Today virtually everyone plays Basic Strategy. Thorp proved that B.S. alone has a 6% player advantage. Yet the casinos continue to beat BS to the tune of 15% avg. Some MN Indian casinos were reporting 52% in the local papers. But I caught them red handed short decking. With 20 of us counting 6's out loud, very loud, in a 6 deck game, we got to 30 before the shoe was dealt half way. There's only 24 in the whole shoe, counting the cut off cards.

Then there's slipping the 5, very common in A.C. and the break down trick at Foxwood. Caught red handed. I could go on and on and on all day long.

In BJ, the odds of ten 10's in a row out of the shoe are 4/13 to the 10th power. The odds against 10 tens are far far greater than the odds of 10 Banks in Bac. Yet we see it every day we play BJ. It has the exact same effect of short decking ten tens. If 6 decks is short decked just one ten, you'll lose. Yet ten tens in BJ doesn't even raise an eyebrow, they are so used to it. We not only know that they do it, we know exactly HOW they do it.

NBJ uses casino orchestration to its advantage. It DOES win at a rate of 6%. Some expert NBJ players report as high as 15%. This would be impossible W/O casino orchestration.

If the shuffle makes no difference (no orchestration) why don't all casinos simply use the same shuffle??? for Bac and BJ? Why don't they all use the same machines??? the same machine settings??? Answer: because it DOES make a difference and a huge one. They use whatever gives them the best bottom line. They call that legal. I call it orchestration. Try it in a Saturday night poker game! You'll find out real quick.

In BJ, why doesn't Vegas simply deal the first dealer card up like AC does. It would make the game go a lot faster. But see, then they couldn't do the Bahama hole card trick.

In spite of tons of first hand red handed evidence, you want to deny what IS and live in some pretend make believe world. What's worse is you continue to gamble on your beliefs and lose. That is your perrogative.
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Last edited by Keith Smith; 08-18-2009 at 10:50 AM.



08-18-2009, 11:46 AM #5 (permalink) garnabby
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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith

Ellis wrote, "You have managed to fill up our entire public index with completely non essential minertia." Ellis, did you mean (non-essential) 'minutia(e)'?

Ellis wrote, "What's worse is you continue to gamble on your beliefs and lose. That is your perrogative." No, that's her (GK's) 'prerogative'.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

At least GK was able to pronounce her misspellings, if indeed (, as i suspect,) hers were not only in jest to your strange mispronuciations, let alone your own seemingly-endless misspellings.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Thorp proved that B.S. alone has a 6% player advantage." That would be a different sort of "B.S." then.

Please refer to &spades;Blackjack House Edge Calculator - The Wizard of Odds for the exact house-edges given those house-specific rules; assuming of course the then-propperly adjusted basic strategies.

I believe its about 0.6% for the house in an average 8-deck (bj) game. You have the "6" right though.

(Sorry for "all the punctuation" but concise, etc, writing demands it.)

08-18-2009, 12:22 PM #6 (permalink) Sucias
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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith
Seems to me, Mr. Davis, your only error is with the euphemism, "orchestration". Why don't we just cut through the bs, and call a spade a spade: CASINO CHEATING.

lol

Casinos everywhere, including but not limited to Vegas, Atlantic City, Casablanca , Connecticut, Monte Carlo, Bahamas, etc...have been cheating since the day they opened their respective doors.

I don't know why.

Greedy, I guess.

Hell, doesn't the book, "The Godfather", open with a quote from Balzac: "behind every great fortune lies a great crime"?


08-18-2009, 12:33 PM #7 (permalink) Sucias
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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith
Look at Steve Wynn.

Two of his biggest business deals were with Howard freaking Hughes, and Michael Milken who went to jail for 100 counts of securities fraud in 1989!

I wouldn't play at Golden Nugget, The Mirage, or Bellagio with his mother's money!

Looks like a duck...



08-18-2009, 12:41 PM #8 (permalink) garnabby
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Re: Casino orcastration is a Mith
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sucias
Seems to me, Mr. Davis, your only error is with the euphemism, "orchestration". Why don't we just cut through the bs, and call a spade a spade: CASINO CHEATING.

lol

Casinos everywhere, including but not limited to Vegas, Atlantic City, Casablanca , Connecticut, Monte Carlo, Bahamas, etc...have been cheating since the day they opened their respective doors.

I don't know why.

Greedy, I guess.

Hell, doesn't the book, "The Godfather", open with a quote from Balzac: "behind every great fortune lies a great crime"?




Sucias,

Generalizations.

Specifically, easier said/written than proved. Besides, why the need for any secretive methods even where and when effective, if at all possible?

Casinos, (government, et al,) have no need, or even want, to cheat the losers. Why? If they want to save money, that's the best way.

The times i (and other winners) have been cheated occurred "to my face".

Oh, now i see... you get your proofs from things like "The Godfather".




P.S. Forgot to ask, if the so-called castration isn't a mith then how could (even) the "free stuff" still be any good.

And then perhaps Ellis should be "blamed" for releasing the "new working systems" on any web-site, especially a "private forum" with an open-to-anyone-with-$500 policy.

Thanks again.




Ellis then replied with something about having an IQ of 160 but still not being able to understand a single thing i wrote here. But that if there's anything garnabby's good at, it's the "minutiae". And "hasn't this been enough fun for the day." To which i replied, we'll have to get you up to 240. And i agree with you about the "fun" part.


************************************************
Ellis later replied, after something more from GK,
Dear garnabby,

E. Clifton Davis has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - Casino orcastration is a Mith - in the Baccarat forum of Beat The Casino Forums "Where The Pros Are".

This thread is located at:
http://www.beatthecasino.com/bb/baccarat/5459-casino-orcastration-mith-new-post.html

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
Well, casinos are corporations. I was raised in the corporations and I know what they are like. The Mafia is more trust worthy.

I have a lot of casino play under my belt, thousands of shoes both in BJ and Bac. I play what I know from experience works. Not somebody elses opinion of what works. I tried that and found that these Gurus have no idea what they are talking about and don't even play. What I do in a casino works. That is what I teach. Neither of these people have any idea of what I do or what I teach. I couldn't care less about articles written by people who don't play. If players want to make use of my experience I'm glad to have them. If they don't want to I'm glad not to have them.

Sucias, you sound like you've been through the trenches too. These two are both saying the same thing. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if they are the same person. It would't be the first time. It would be the eighth for GarnabY or whatever.

I think we can all agree on the bottom line. Martingales are suicidal. Lets let that be that.

Now I see another one on one of the BJ channels. Recommends playing a Martingale with the count. Ten losses in a row in a plus count happens all the time. He'll find out soon enough.
************************************************** **


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Here's another from danielsan,

Dear garnabby,

danielsan has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - Casino orcastration is a Mith - in the Baccarat forum of Beat The Casino Forums "Where The Pros Are".

This thread is located at:
http://www.beatthecasino.com/bb/baccarat/5459-casino-orcastration-mith-new-post.html

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************

---Quote (Originally by garnabby)---
'You have managed to fill up our entire public index with completely non essential minertia." Ellis, did you mean (non-essential) 'minutia(e)'?

"What's worse is you continue to gamble on your beliefs and lose. That is your perrogative." No, that's her 'prerogative'.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

At least GK was able to pronounce her misspellings, if indeed (, as i suspect,) hers were not only in jest to your strange mispronuciations, let alone your own seemingly-endless misspellings.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Thorp proved that B.S. alone has a 6% player advantage." That would be a different sort of "B.S." then.

Please refer to &spades;Blackjack House Edge Calculator - The Wizard of Odds (http://wizardofodds.com/blackjack/house-edge-calculator-pop.html) for the exact house-edges given those house-specific rules; assuming of course the then-propperly adjusted basic strategies.

I believe its about 0.6% for the house in an average 8-deck (bj) game. You have the "6" right though.

(Sorry for "all the punctuation" but concise, etc, writing demands it.)
---End Quote---


Hey Garnabby,

There is no point in pointing out grammatical errors because I can obviously see your errors flashing at me. English may not be the first language for many people online because, as you can see, this is the World Wide Web, not the English Writing-and-speaking Web. As you may not know, the average English speaking person would fittingly have, shall we say, average grammar. If we were all perfect, then we would all be English Professors.
***************


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Though i didn't get the opportunity to respond to danielsan's "hoity-toity" sublimations... what to say to him anyway, to another one who completely missed the whole point of the thread. (No, the point of that thread isn't "wasting time" on the road to nowhere anyway.)

Like just about every member over there. I guess that's what being in some sort of "cult" is all about. But their numbers seem to be thinning since the last time i logged on there.

And note the note about Keith Smith editing Ellis's post. What's up with that? Ellis finally gone completely-senile? (He used to pass such off as too many "drinks".)

GK, if you're still out there, please keep up the "good work".

Has he got a system that works I had a few of them from twister days He had his shill posting he/she won big with them if twister not work then anti-twister would I mean right from the early days those were supposed to work and make money and that is what people bought for their hard earned money

Then he must got complaints so he invented orchestration thing as I remember from those days orchestration wasnt even mentioned until later after alot people had bought the systems

Casino orchestration sounds good because it an us vs them type of thing how dare the big bad casino cheat the little gambler

so he had system specially for the type of wash the cards got there was probably another method for streaky shoes and one for choppy one for both

Then he come up with a club thing for people to seemingly help tweak the methods that were supposed to work in the first place what happened to all the winners from the twister days if anything he certainly is a good salesman and he says he got an iq 160 so he can talk down to peeps if you cant understand it is ok because i can lol

UPDATE......

Okay, i was banned again yesterday evening, and this morning (, except for one computer,) but am now free to post yet again (by both).

I was just over at BTC to thank Keith for the "second" chance.

This is a new development for them, probably for the good. I never decried Ellis for having a special forum for paid members but for intimating he had a consistently-winning system. Maybe they'll spend more time focusing on the former now.

garnabby,

Evidently I'm the only guy on all these forums who hasn't been banned somewhere.

I'll read and continue to add to the discussions as needed here and at ProjectB.

AD

Originally Posted by ADulay

garnabby,

Evidently I'm the only guy on all these forums who hasn't been banned somewhere.

I'll read and continue to add to the discussions as needed here and at ProjectB.

AD

AD,

I guess it's important to remember that the internet is really just an extension of the telephone... where the "old" laws of harassment, and standards of etiquette (do) carry.

I, myself, have "pushed the envelop" here and there, but mostly in confrontations with site-administrators.

Remember though, "getting banned" from the more well-known sites makes it more difficult to get registered, etc, on others. (And i think there's some sort of "list" out there; and also at least one site catering to only "those banned" who wish to "vent" something about it. Checked out one such site a while back... but sorry, i didn't copy the link. Quite a violent site, in fact.)

P.S. Your contributions in the private forum are always welcome. Thanks.

Hi there Garnabby GK here, i was also banned last yr around xmas by the Davis clan under this user name thebaccaratkid, archer will remember me im sure...I even managed to get comped by davis into the members section when i first joined but eventually the Davis dribble finally got to me and i blew my cover !!.
Im wearing my visits under GK very thin over there but hopefully ill not get the boot before i can do some more damage..

Originally Posted by thebaccaratkid

Hi there Garnabby GK here, i was also banned last yr around xmas by the Davis clan under this user name thebaccaratkid, archer will remember me im sure...I even managed to get comped by davis into the members section when i first joined but eventually the Davis dribble finally got to me and i blew my cover !!.
Im wearing my visits under GK very thin over there but hopefully ill not get the boot before i can do some more damage..

thebaccaratkid,

Fooled me, i still hadn't figured who or what "GK" was up to. Also i have been known by a couple of aliases in my brief time on some of these boards... mostly to "test" their software; and at the other end of the spectrum, to have a little harmless "fun".

I know Ellis, and the "gang" are big enough to deal with the latter. And by and large the overwhelming majority of the persons, including those involved with this sort of "monkey business" (, or "baccarat shit" as i sometimes refer to it when it "starts to get away from me"), are honest enough to not make up (too many) things here. But i guess the loyalty which often goes hand in hand with that sometimes gets in the way.

I haven't heard from Archer in a while, but i'm sure he's out there still looking for ways to better his baccarat-play. Most don't know it but he, himself, has quite a backgroung in the game. And he actually seems (to me, from his correspondence to myself,) to see a lot of good qualities in Ellis' work... such as Ellis' dedication to the "art" of the game, and firsthand knowledge of Ellis' persistence playing it.

My biggest "problem" with BTC in the past, anyway, has in my opinion and experience been its censorship of anything threatening to their methods as being infallible. But then of course also the "loyalty" thing going on there once everyone is otherwise "convinced". Regardless, it looks as though the "Ellis era" is perhaps just about over, and that Keith may be trying to re-shape the forum to meet a more realistic club-based goal in the future.

Glad to meet you "on the (only) other side", BK; though i enjoyed your posts over there.

Oh well, looks like Looks like Ellis threw away his own second from myself anyway by playing the ban-game again. I guess it's true that some persons just can't help themselves, or be "worked with" to help themselves. I had hoped Keith, after the many "spasms" his forum has endured lately to try to save itself, had finally seen the light. That, eg, our forum here, and most other (successful) boards across the web, get by just fine w/o banning anyone but the (obvious) advertizers, and the completely-unreadable posts (, mostly from his "camp"). I'll be putting my "Beware of Ellis at Beat the Casino Forums" notices back up on every site i run in to (, at http://www.worldcasinodirectory.com/...rums-15586.htm ). LET'S RUN THE REST OF HIS GARBAGE BACK INTO THE GROUND FOR GOOD, shall i? Perhaps the next message to be reciprocated back to Ellis, himself, ought to be the same one so many others have unfairly and rudely received from him:

vBulletin Message

You have been banned for the following reason:

No reason was specified.

Date the ban will be lifted: Never

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's my "problem-reply" to a few posts there yesterday, but first Ellis's emailed-reply to my own likely-removed-by-now post. (What the heck is he talking about? Certainly not baccarat, or anything baccarat-related.)

Dear garnabby,

E. Clifton Davis has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!! - in the Baccarat forum of Beat The Casino Forums "Where The Pros Are".

This thread is located at:

http://www.beatthecasino.com/bb/baccarat/5481-private-forum-red-hot-right-now-new-post.html

Here is the message that has just been posted:

***************

I just finished explaining why we teach multiple systems to your other half. Why do you consistently ignore facts just as she does?

Why do you push betting on losers just as she does?

Why do you complain about IQs just as she does?

Why do you persist to post off topic on our threads just as she does?

Why do you have such a fettish for losing just as she does?

Why do you ignore remarks from winning players just as she does?

Why do YOU react when I correct HER spelling errors?

When NO ONE ELSE does these things but you two.

When one dissappears, the other always appears immediately like J and H both with the same personality quirck.

IF it looks like ONE duck, quacks like ONE duck........

***************

There may also be other replies, but you will not receive any more notifications until you visit the forum again.

All the best,

Beat The Casino Forums "Where The Pros Are"

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!! Quote:

Originally Posted by zebra

The REAL problem with people like Giselle, Archer and others whose names I don't recall, is that they cause Ellis to waste his valuable time (see previous post) answering them. That time could and should be devoted to improving SKOR.

I spent several months in the public forum before getting an opportunity to try the free system. Three shoes in AC made me $700, more than enough for membership, and since then I spend whatever portion of my valuable time I can in the private forum. I wish Ellis had the same opportunity. Keith - we are NOT governed by any mandate of "free speech". I totally agree with Nizmo and acqueen. Potentially productive private members like Sara could by turned off by all this garbage.

(My reply,)
Wow. (And i cleaned up Zebra's post.) But isn't it even more important for the novices to hear the other side(s) of any story, there always being another side? No one knows it all all the time... not even Ellis who has turned out one "best ever" system after another, and will have another next month. And i think it's only fair if i spend the time to learn something from you, you ought to at least spend a little of yours to learn something back from me. Ultimately, aren't we all "internet guys" here?

Second, losing certainly can and does happen by any system of any game... but there are "surprisingly few" actual accounts of any of that (left) on at least this "side of the board" from any sort of member. Why is that? Or more to the point, why then believe any of the more-lengthy "positive" anecdotal testimonials here?

There's nothing very- special or deplorable about private clubs of any sort, which are only meeting places for mutual friends at similar stages in their lives. It's their right however they choose to conduct themselves there... or even here in the so-called public forum, where then the usual rules ought to apply. But just like there are always sometimes losers by any system, there are always consequences for those "freely-chosen" paths of conduct. Not the least of which is perhaps never really discovering the one (best) possibly-consistent winning system, or whichever thing it is being sought, because they failed to truly work together... let alone this particular task already having been "ditched" by many "minds" far greater than Ellis or any of his paid-followers, including the doctors, et al.

Isn't it amazing at just how little interest so many apparently so-abreast of the baccarat-world continue to show all its new developments. It's been said that sometimes the most open-minded persons are really the most closed-minded, but i've never heard that the other way around. I, myself, would have long ago paid much more than a paltry $500 for any system or forum showing at least some such basic consideration in this direction. JUST FOR THE ENTERTAINMENT.

09-07-2009, 11:46 AM #13 (permalink) acqueen

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by E. Clifton Davis

His (Tom) scores were 15,15,12, 10 and +6 on the partial.

He didn't play more because he was there for other reasons.

Now a 100% win rate is quite spectacular in itself as you know, but consider this:

He played 100% mechanically to the 3 rules of SKOR 2Hi.

No judgement calls whatsoever.

His average no of bets per shoe was less than 50.

His avg bet size was about 1 unit.

His highest bet was 2 units.

His commission was negligible.

His Player Avantage was super high double digit.

Now I challenge you to go out and find ANYONE, ANYWHERE that EVER played better than that. EVER!
__________________

This is only my 2nd post, and ironically under the same thread, but I think people should know this:

I play exclusively for my income. I do a few consulting jobs a year in my other line of work to keep my name out there, but that is my supplemental income only.

This investment I made here, to join your forum, has been one of the best investments I have ever made. A trusted financial advisor once told me: "Never hesitate to invest in yourself, be it a full time education or an occasional class." I considered this "an occasional class" when I first signed into it, but now it has blossomed into a full time education. Let me tell you why:

1) I am able to quickly garner new ideas, whether I sit here and read or simply log on, print out a few sample shoes and run.

2) I am able to reinforce my playing style by looking at people with "like styles". I studied Tom's shoes and I know WHY he won.. the system was good and he had the discipline to get out AHEAD! Hit and run. Somedays I can sit at a table for hours, knowing conditions are right to make my day's worth or over. Other times I'm searching for quite some time to find the right table, only to sit for a short time, knowing I've gotten the best out of it that I can for the conditions of the day.

Point is, I know how to tell table/casino conditions, I know what to play based on those conditions, and I know when to stay and when to go. And the average joe doesn't realize this point, but the average joe WILL learn this in your course. And that will be the difference between playing for fun and playing to pay your mortgage, which is what I do.

I didn't mean to fan the flames by my earlier post, to the person who posted a negative response, but I DO take it personally when someone says you can't exploit a casino bias! I do it everyday because I've caught on to it and have the tools and THE DISCIPLINE to follow it and turn the casino margin to my favor.

So, thank you, Mr.E. I'd really like the opportunity to sit at a table with you someday. Perhaps I could teach *you* something in exchange for all you've taught me!

09-07-2009, 08:55 AM #12 (permalink) E. Clifton Davis

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

Copied from the NU System thread:

AD, I see you know a thing or two about Baccarat so you'll really appreciate this:

Obviously I can't post his shoes but one of our private members just returned from Vegas yesterday and posted his actual casino cards. He played 4 1/2 shoes (Gold Coast). His (Tom) scores were 15,15,12, 10 and +6 on the partial.

He didn't play more because he was there for other reasons.

Now a 100% win rate is quite spectacular in itself as you know, but consider this:

He played 100% mechanically to the 3 rules of SKOR 2Hi.

No judgement calls whatsoever.

His average no of bets per shoe was less than 50.

His avg bet size was about 1 unit.

His highest bet was 2 units.

His commission was negligible.

His Player Avantage was super high double digit.

Now I challenge you to go out and find ANYONE, ANYWHERE that EVER played better than that. EVER!

I rest my case.

And consider this: He COULD have been playing $5000 units and still have been completely within the table limits.

Yep 58 units in about 250 plays never betting more than 2 units!

That's what a well trained player can accomplish! Tom's been a private member for about a year now and I don't even consider him as one of our best but he started playing immediately after he joined and I don't think he has ever lost. Is that right Tom?

09-05-2009, 02:30 PM #11 (permalink) E. Clifton Davis

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

So, if giselle doesn't mind too much, or even if he or she does, let's get back to Baccarat, namely SKOR 2Hi.

First, giselle has never been on the private forum and has no inkling of what we teach there. We teach multiple table selection systems because there are nine different shoe types. On the public forum we only deal with two types, chop and streak. And many of the public don't even get that much.

But, in addition to better table selection systems we also teach two Universal 2Hi systems on the private forum. SAP and SKOR 2Hi. 2Hi means you never bet more than 2 units. "Universal" means we don't care a hoot about table selection or shuffle type. So why waste time discussing shuffles? SAP has had an excellent win record for three years straight. But it is too complex for some. Players want a system they can learn overnight. Likewise I want a system I can teach to ANYONE overnight. So, I designed SKOR 2Hi. If you can count to 4 you can play SKOR 2Hi. But we never expected such a simple system to do so well.

Everything I and several of the private members have said here on the public forum about SKOR 2Hi is precisely correct. If it weren't other private members would quickly come and contradict us. If you made it thru 4th grade math you KNOW what we are saying. Best system ever!

09-05-2009, 02:21 PM #10 (permalink) zebra

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

The REAL problem with people like Giselle, Archer and others whose names

I don't recall, is that they cause Ellis to waste his valuable time (see previous post) answering them. That time could and should be devoted to improving

SKOR. Members of the private forum are similarly involved with learning and improving what appears to be a truly winning method. We seldom even look here in the public forum anymore, and so are not caught up in Giselle's crap.

I spent several months in the public forum before getting an opportunity to try the free system. Three shoes in AC made me $700, more than enough for membership, and since then I spend whatever portion of my valuable time I can in the private forum. I wish Ellis had the same opportunity. Keith - we are NOT governed by any mandate of "free speech". I totally agree with Nizmo and acqueen. Potentially productive private members like Sara could by turned off by all this garbage. Once a skunk like Giselle has shown his (her?) stripe, it's time to make him (her?) disappear. See you later - I'm going back to the other side where the air is much cleaner.

09-05-2009, 01:41 PM #9 (permalink) E. Clifton Davis

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

Let's set the record straight.

Giselle says shuffles don't matter, only the cut matters. No facts supporting her claim whatsoever. Pure opinion. My biggest problem with this is novices reading this on our site might believe it, much to their detriment.

So lets examine a few facts:

Casinos have spent BILLIONS over the last 20 years perfecting shuffle technique. They did this because multi deck BJ quickly taught them that the shuffle is everything in multi deck. They were rewarded by the fact that casino bottom line in BJ climbed from 6% of the take to 15% as casinos learned more about shuffrle technique and its effect on bottom line.

Most of this profit increase occurred in the late 80's. I know this because as an editor of BJ Confidential at that time we reported the BJ take % for both Vegas and AC every month.

AC was the first to experiment outside of the 8 standard BJ shuffles of that day. Likewise AC reported the first major increases in BJ profits. So Vegas followed suit and their profits rose accordingly.

At that time Baccarat was strictly 8 deck 14 player games and the take retension in Bac was at 3%. We also reported on that. They used the same standard Bac shuffle all over the world. But the AC Casino Mgrs thought well it worked in BJ therefore.... So they abandoned the standard Bac shuffle and went with BJ shuffles which by then ranged in the hundreds. Their profits soared immediately from 3% to 26% for the major Vegas Casinos today - taken from their own profit reports. Recognize that we are talking about a per capita profit. So the number of players has nothing to do with it.

It's easier to see the shuffle effect in Baccarat because during that time right on through until today NOTHING else changed. The rules, the number of decks, the number of cut off cards are all exactly the same today as they were in the late 80s. The shuffle was the ONLY thing to change yet casino profits per player capita increased nearly 900%.

Of course giselle attributes this to casino marketing. Good marketing increases the number of players. It has nothing to do with casino profits per player.

The only thing left is shuffle technique. Or perhaps its all just a big coincidencve. Sure, 900% worth of coincidence!

Or, you could deal a few hands of Baccarat to yourself and disprove all of this. Sure you could. I wonder why the casinos didn't just do that rather than spend billions???

Then there's that crazy thing about IQ. Take a pro football team that suddenly inherits a top league talent. Most of the players, the normal ones, will thank their lucky stars. But there are always a few abnormals who will challenge this talent in spite of all evidence out of insane jealousy. I've run into that sort my whole life. What's one more.

__________________

BeatTheCasino

09-05-2009, 12:17 PM #8 (permalink) Audionut

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

To ANYBODY reading this in the public forum:

I have seen nothing but positive qualities/feedback an professionalism from Ellis and everyone else on the private forum. Everyone has the same goal: BEAT THE CASINO on a consistent basis. People contribute, learn, and help each other here.

Definitely worth the price of admission.

Please, there are plenty of OTHER sites to argue or bash other people. Go to one of these if that is where your interests lie.

09-05-2009, 12:14 PM #7 (permalink) Keith Smith

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

Quote:This is a terribly moderated forum.

No message board worth anything would allow this to continue. It is NOT user-friendly!I'm all for free speech, playing Devil's Advocate, etc, and giving anybody a chance, but this guy, Giselle, has had his chances. Hell, blackjackinfo.com has better, clearer, friendlier Baccarat forums than this. I say good luck to Ellis in attracting any new members to his site. He's going to need it.

Thank you and your point is noted. What I'm trying to do is show that we are not shunning differing opinions, which is something we had been accused of in the past. As a matter of fact, I welcome the differing opinions because they allow us to respectfully and confidently show that OUR SYSTEMS WORK!!

As for having better, clearer, forums: I use v-bulletin, the most popular, user friendly system out there. There are many ways you can see new posts, and subscribe/unsubscribe from the posts that interest you. You can even choose to ignore posts from certain users. If you need help investigating this, PM me.

Regards, KS

09-05-2009, 12:05 PM #6 (permalink) Sara_Emanuelle

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith Smith

No, Giselle, you're not ruining another sales campaign. Your personal grudge will not stop our members from winning. But your banter does generate interest in this thread, which points out the winning (please see initial post above) going on in our Private Forum, so I thank you for that.

I disagree. Considering the thread is titled, "The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!", not only do I believe that Giselle does nothing to enhance any interest in that topic, but that his posts are detrimental to any users that have to wade through the mountains of utter crap posted by him in order to find some words of wisdom.

Why do I have to read through post after post of "Martingale" this and "Martingale" that in order to find something on SKOR 2Hi that was suggested to me by the author himself?

I shouldn't have to.

I'm all for free speech, playing Devil's Advocate, etc, and giving anybody a chance, but this guy, Giselle, has had his chances.

I say good luck to Ellis.

09-05-2009, 10:56 AM #5 (permalink) acqueen

Re: The Private Forum is RED HOT right now!!

Giselle, I have been a Member here for a while. A silent Member. I paid my membership like most people did.. with winnings from playing the free systems. I check in occasionally (as I did this morning), as I have to download SKOR information, and then I'm out playing and making a living doing it.

But I can't help but think you are here specifically to bash something you know nothing about. I've spent the last few minutes going through your old posts, specifically these:

"1989 was the year that changed my future forever it was the year i discovered horse racing...turns out its not all it seems and making money was not easy after all so after 17 years of addiction in 2006 i did something that once again changed my life in a way that i will regret for the rest of my life.. I stole a lot of money and left my country knowing if i went back ill spend time in jail, this was an attempt to stop gambling and start a new life far away from my past life.."

And this: in 1995 i discovered casinos and it wasn't long before baccarat was the game i spent all my time playing..so 3 yrs after i took the cash and left town im still playing baccarat, why well thats easy because i have a plan and i believe it works but the problem is it only works some of the time and in the last 14 years of playing baccarat ive lost every cent ive earned to the game and that includes all my winnings too !!

I am absolutely dumbfounded that someone with your history, particularly running from an impending criminal conviction, would think that YOUR WORD, IN ANY WAY, would be enough to be "in the way of a sales pitch"...

Apparently your grudge is with Ellis Davis... perhaps you didn't play his system right in the past? You claim you are a "changed man".. or are you a woman??

"Im a changed man and when i look back on those 20 years i can see why the life has been sucked out of me to a point i feel like a worthless candidate for any hope of having a family of my own i can share my life with.."

Perhaps your grudge is with gambling in general, as you obviously lost your money, your reputation, your morals, and your freedom to return to your home, by playing BADLY. If you want to start a support group for people who pushed gambling so far to the edge THAT THEY FELL OFF, go ahead and do it. But don't come in here and bash those of us who have the ability to seek out ways to win, and the required maturity and self-control needed to become winners. It makes you sound weak and classless.

I'll bet you can't throw a baseball, or kick a football good enough to make money at it. So does that make all those who practiced their game and made it to the Big Leagues "sinister" ?? Because that's what you're trying to do to us, and really, it's getting a bit childish.

************************************************** *****



SORRY ARCHER, BUT I MUST NOW CONCLUDE THAT YOU WERE WRONG ABOUT EVEN ELLIS' SINCERITY... JUST ANOTHER CHEAP SCAM THROUGH AND THROUGH.

AND OF COURSE ELLIS AND HIS "CAMP" WERE FREELY WELCOMED TO ALL OF MY OWN WORK, AND TO THIS FORUM... BUT NOT A SINGLE REPLY.

This afternoon's developments with Ellis. I didn't want to re-bump this thread to the top anymore, but given the number of readers... .

I checked out BTC at work today for a few minutes, (but Ellis & co. please don't report me, ha,) to find this over there, well as my recent posts deleted. It pretty much speaks for itself, in the ways in which no one there says anything "to your face", and if so, it's only there to be soon deleted (when someone "sobers up"). Except for the "felony" part of this... does Ellis really confuse his "forum-rules" with the regular "laws of the land", or the "higher laws" of some other greater purpose? Is that why his "bunch of bananas" over there are vigilantly "on guard" at their "posts"? (I mean a person can't write much of anything of value over there w/o the "switch-board" literally lighting up one by one until Aegis finally "wakes ups" to ban its author, and delete the post(s). Is there no other possible post than, "I win win win by "uncle Ellis" everytime everywhere i play." And could the impossibility of that be yet an other reason for their "swarming" at the first signs of one or two of their group actually winning for a day or two?) And it looks like Ellis is now in the business of "hawking" casino-comps for a $500/year membership... a couple of nights/year at the most (for Tunica?), right? (It's like they say, "If the price isn't on it, you can't afford it.")

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09-08-2009, 06:39 AM #1 (permalink)
E. Clifton Davis
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Finally, the truth about Garnabby / giselle knowles

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For those who give a hoot and I realize that is a very small number,
thanks to our private member Zebra, we now know the truth about our
constant detracter garnabby. See Zebra's very welcome post below and my
limited comments below that.


Hi Ellis, regarding Garnabby:

I just had a peek at Garnabby's forum and saw these messages posted. It
comes as no surprise that the Baccarat Kid identifies himself as "GK"
(could that be Giselle Knowles?) and he brags about wanting to do some
more damage before he gets the boot (again).
These morons will not stop. I think a quick boot at the first sign of
their BS will help put an end to their meddling. BTW, I'm certain that the
guy Gablaw and I were speaking to in Vegas was other than Garnabby. He
used many of the same phrases Garnabby used in his posts. On a more
pleasant note,
I am working out plans to join you in Tunica. I will let you know when
plans are completed.
Paul




#7 Yesterday, 07:07 AM
thebaccaratkid
BaccaratForums Member Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: London
Posts: 1

Re: Banned again, part 1...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi there Garnabby GK here, i was also banned last yr around xmas by the
Davis clan under this user name thebaccaratkid, archer will remember me im
sure...I even managed to get comped by davis into the members section when
i first joined but eventually the Davis dribble finally got to me and i
blew my cover !!.
Im wearing my visits under GK very thin over there but hopefully ill not
get the boot before i can do some more damage..


thebaccaratkid
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#8 Yesterday, 08:33 PM
garnabby
BaccaratForums Member Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kitchener, Ontario, Canada
Age: 48
Posts: 159

Re: Banned again, part 1...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by thebaccaratkid
Hi there Garnabby GK here, i was also banned last yr around xmas by the
Davis clan under this user name thebaccaratkid, archer will remember me im
sure...I even managed to get comped by davis into the members section when
i first joined but eventually the Davis dribble finally got to me and i
blew my cover !!.
Im wearing my visits under GK very thin over there but hopefully ill not
get the boot before i can do some more damage..



thebaccaratkid,

Fooled me, i still hadn't figured who or what "GK" was up to. Also i have
been known by a couple of aliases in my brief time on some of these
boards... mostly to "test" their software; and at the other end of the
spectrum, to have a little harmless "fun".

I know Ellis, and the "gang" are big enough to deal with the latter. And
by and large the overwhelming majority of the persons, including those
involved with this sort of "monkey business" (, or "baccarat shit" as i
sometimes refer to it when it "starts to get away from me"), are honest
enough to not make up (too many) things here. But i guess the loyalty
which often goes hand in hand with that sometimes gets in the way.

I haven't heard from Archer in a while, but i'm sure he's out there still
looking for ways to better his baccarat-play. Most don't know it but he,
himself, has quite a backgroung in the game. And he actually seems (to me,
from his correspondence to myself,) to see a lot of good qualities in
Ellis' work... such as Ellis' dedication to the "art" of the game, and
firsthand knowledge of Ellis' persistence playing it.

My biggest "problem" with BTC in the past, anyway, has in my opinion and
experience been its censorship of anything threatening to their methods as
being infallible. But then of course also the "loyalty" thing going on
there once everyone is otherwise "convinced". Regardless, it looks as
though the "Ellis era" is perhaps just about over, and that Keith may be
trying to re-shape the forum to meet a more realistic club-based goal in
the future.

zebra


Ellis again: Just to set the record straight, no one has ever been
censored on BTC. Garnabby has been banned now under I think 8 different
aliases. I suspect that BK (Bacarrat Kid) is yet another alias he uses to
fool the people on his OWN site. He talks to himself under two of his
aliases. I know this because both say the exact same thing the same way
and both spell the same words wrong the same way. It's no wonder he can't
understand loyalty. That would be a completely foreign concept to him.
This whacko has only one goal, destruction. His GK admissions confirm that
he is a big time gambling loser who commits felonies to cover his losses.
For that reason he seems to go into an insanity tailspin whenever
confronted by a winner or anyone smarter than he thinks he is. I don't
know what the psychiatrists call that but I'm sure they have a name for
it. Obviously he has no winning system or he wouldn't be spending all his
time trying to demolish other sites. Anyway, enough time wasted. Good
riddance!
__________________
BeatTheCasino
ellis@beatthecasino.com

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last edited by E. Clifton Davis; 09-08-2009 at 06:53 AM.




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Wow Garnabby! You've got a serious fixation. How come?

Yep, it's me as you can quickly tell. Not hiding behind any aliases.

GARNABBY,

Beatthecasino, is a system development forum, nothing else. I went over there, applied his OT14 with my own twist and tripled the membership fee in 5 days. Then, it fell apart like all systems do.
The only thing I disagree with Ellis, is the fact that they are still trying to develop new systems, to beat every situation, but, then again you are as well. We all are, the only difference is Ellis is making money from it and you and I are not.

The best methods in the world are, the ones that come from a lightening bolt of idea. They, get those sparks over there in the private forum, but then find a losing situation, and continously, ad nauseum try TO BEAT EVERY SITUATION. Instead of accepting the loss. THAT IS THE PROBLEM OVER THERE.
I spend my mornings gambling, making money.GIVE me any method that wins only an average of 50% of the time, and I'll make money with it.


ALL SYSTEMS WORK SOME OF THE TIME,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

no system works all of the time.......................


R/S

Originally Posted by now here

ALL SYSTEMS WORK SOME OF THE TIME,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

no system works all of the time.......................


R/S

I agree.. HOWEVER, the key to consistent winning is to know WHEN to switch systems. I don't play 1 system, I have about 5 tricks up my sleeve, whether it's bac or the idiots at a poker table.

But I gotta know this.. Garbanny, do you work for beat the casino?? Driving all this traffic to their site? Or are you truly that disgruntled that you look unbalanced?? Gotta know dude!!

Hmmm, the rhetoric sure changed in a hurry!

Hi AD, better not let Mr. G know how well you're doing with my free systems. Liable to burst something vital.

Hi Paul! We playing together again before the month ends? You won the last time we played together.

Originally Posted by Ellis

Hmmm, the rhetoric sure changed in a hurry!

Off hand, first, 'rhetoric' by definition is about the obvious... and that never changes.

Second, arguement, disgruntlement or fixation, whichever you want to call "it" here isn't again by definition necessarily a bad thing. On the contrary each and every "bolt of lightening" took years of (seriously) thinking about some thing. Ellis, in my own opinion anyway, by "starting at the top" never made the "first step".

Third, "Driving all this traffic to their site? Or are you truly that disgruntled that you look unbalanced?? Gotta know dude!!" The only thing wrt baccarat that i want to know is how to properly win at it. If Ellis has to make a "few extra dollars" for his hard work in the process, fair enough. Ultimately is it really that important to, eg, Sinatra's music that he, himself as a person, has been popularly described as something less.

Nice to hear from you Ellis, where the "aire really is out in the open". Welcome, and thanks to also yourself, PokerChic... all i can really tell you for now is that some of the biggest "arguements" i've had in the past have led to some of my best friendships, given the chance.

I visited your progressions thread. Saw some suicidal progs over there with no rebuttals from your leaders.

You're much better off net betting U1D1 PvB esp if you see P and B running close at a table. They've got to get out of whack by 9 for you to lose which is rare. You'll pick up 50 units a shoe a whole lot safer than the progs I saw. Doesn't the Garn teach you the basics or does he spend ALL his time knocking those who do teach?

Originally Posted by Ellis

I visited your progressions thread. Saw some suicidal progs over there with no rebuttals from your leaders.

You're much better off net betting U1D1 PvB esp if you see P and B running close at a table. They've got to get out of whack by 9 for you to lose which is rare. You'll pick up 50 units a shoe a whole lot safer than the progs I saw. Doesn't the Garn teach you the basics or does he spend ALL his time knocking those who do teach?

Ellis,

Systemhunter's thread is more about just those "suicidal progs" (which i recall noting). I went on to include, eg, some of the Wizard's (math) work supporting the use of progressions at all (in baccarat)... a matter not at all addressed seriously in any way at Katweezel's thread Wizard of Odds plugs progression bet - Blackjack and Card Counting Forums - BlackjackInfo.com over at Blackjack and Card Counting Forums - BlackjackInfo.com by even Sonny (, i still think aka Savant,) who had the same canned reply for every other progression issue there. And there's always the "Gambling theory" thread for those who wish to pursue their own basic (or advanced) work.

"You're much better off net betting U1D1 PvB esp if you see P and B running close at a table. They've got to get out of whack by 9 for you to lose which is rare." Not rare enough. W/o getting into very-technical matters such as "drop & hold", random-walk theory, etc, every style of betting mathematically, and logically, reduces to the same thing on some scale. Often what happens is different persons fail to see each others' points of that discussion... that any gain one way is eaten up by a loss in an other. Eg, this recent thread, Gambler's Glen Message Boards : Baccarat Message Board : Trip Report and Learning How to Lose , from the GG. (I think there are already some explanatory threads about that here in the past, but perhaps it's time now someone wrote one out in specific?) Note however that the distinguishing features of the specific types and degrees of progressions, of which "flat" betting is merely the trivial case, still hold in their technical conversations.

Anyway, baccarat having its basic strategy for the banker (analogous to the bj-player) performed solely by the dealer, we must move more-directly to the advanced strategies. The fact there are so many basic strategies/concepts still brought out in the main forum for the casual browers among us is a tribute to how far we have come in the last year. (And just to be clear about something else, i am in no way a part of the BF's organization. But i, myself, strive to be nothing more than another peruser/contributor. Just because i wrote the thread, "Lead, follow or get out of the way", doesn't make me either option per se.)

There is a private forum here for 100 persons (, 24 spots left,) who wish to "talk shop" about the most-advanced baccarat-methods (of my knowledge) to date. No fee; and no more spots later. (I'll invite you just in case you're the least bit curious.) And an other private forum apparently for the most-serious of those by an other member here.

rhet-o-ric n. showy elaborate language that is empty or insincere.

When your opening statement is obviously false, why would I read further?

....But, of course I did. I'm glad to hear that at least some have picked up my crusade for limited progressions in favorable situations. It wasn't that many years ago that I was one sole voice crying in the throng of very angry voices decrying progs of any type.

But nothing ever stays the same. Who knows maybe some day even you......naaaaw, sorry, got carried away there.

Well OK I visited your forum, not bad, but I must get back to mine. It is my full time job. BTW do you have a full time job? Do you get paid for it? Does anyone complain to you about that? Yep, that would be really strange wouldn't it??? On that note, farewell and good luck!

Originally Posted by Ellis

....But, of course I did. I'm glad to hear that at least some have picked up my crusade for limited progressions in favorable situations. It wasn't that many years ago that I was one sole voice crying in the throng of very angry voices decrying progs of any type.

But nothing ever stays the same. Who knows maybe some day even you......naaaaw, sorry, got carried away there.

Well OK I visited your forum, not bad, but I must get back to mine. It is my full time job. BTW do you have a full time job? Do you get paid for it? Does anyone complain to you about that? Yep, that would be really strange wouldn't it??? On that note, farewell and good luck!

Ellis,

Well, as is my wont to "leave no stone unturned", (and though i like to let the last words to the other guy, you really didn't sum anything up for us)...

..... since my recent foray into these forums last winter, i have "clocked" about 250 posts (, counting the ones youze deleted). Each standing on its own yet all together serially spanning that relatively brief period. And as i've already written elsewhere, eg, "Any one with 1000's of (hence "empty") posts must have some sort of emotional problem(s)... it just doesn't take long to quickly write consistently and fully once about something actually lived, as with this post; to strut your stuff, or stay mentally focused in the "off-season", in real time here by such message-boards. It sure didn't take so long as you want "let on" to completely turn your own ideas inside-out. (And that's why, eg, kittens "play fight"... to see who's the "boss" w/o actually "spilling any blood" over it. Again, and unless you, Ellis, can present any proof to the contrary, i own nor profit by any web-sites... nor anything baccarat-related (here) for that matter. And until you figure out exactly once and for all what the word 'proof' means, i suggest you not bother trying. I do it because i love trying to make "the impossible" possible. I've done it before, and i'll do it again.)

That's how we figure it out then, who's working (or "out of operation"), from reading between the lines here... if not also by what is actually written, itself. My private life will likely remain private. Though i may perhaps make a few of my own playing engagements public from time to time "just to keep up appearances" for some my newer acquaintences here, no one shall ever know the half of it.

Anyone can sit back and claim they already knew something. Only an expert on a subject can do the research, testing, and propper documentation... the real work/job of a professional theorist. Suffice it to say that the Wizard is certainly not any sort of a believer in our chances of consistently beating baccarat in any normal sense of the word 'beat'. But i guess had you even more of a technical interest, nay more of a sincerity-thing with you, you would have at least read what i had written... and claimed, "I already knew that long before anyone else!" But wait, ya, right... like Thorp quickly sold half a million copies (after a winning-streak at bj) of a $2 pamphlet that you already knew about.

In the end, (and where else to go with this?), i never in a million years thought that i would find those cult-ways of thinking here. I surely already knew of the "divided and conquered world" which is baccarat, and of the the sometimes "shabby existence" to be found on line, but i just never... .

Sure, what the heck, go back to your private-public "indoctrination" rituals over there at BTC. Say hi to Keith for me, who seems "caught up trying to explain it to himself". It was never my intent to formally put an end to "something" which will "run its course one way or the other" anyway, through the normal course of events... even by my own posts necessarily touching on these things.

I wonder if i've learnt more from you than any of your "core" supporters, who OBVIOUSLY NEVER PLAY (because the turnover is just too high at this game for that to be reasonably believed)?

Garnabby, I have no idea of what you said or even if you are asking me to do something. Can anyone translate his post into whatever it is he's trying to say? I'd be happy to reply but I have no idea of what the question was or even if there was a question.

Hmmm, I guess not so let me take a stab. A really wild guess is that you are basically saying that Baccarat is a random 50/50 game plus commission and therefore can't be beat. That my main players, therefore, must not play or they would be broke by now. Is that about the size of it?
A yes or no would do but while you are at it let me know your stance on BJ also. Do you believe it can be beat with CC and BS or do you feel the same way as Bac or do you have no stance on that game? I just want to confirm the jist of what you are saying before attempting a reply so I don't waste our time replying to a misconception of what you are saying. Probably wasting our valuable time anyway.

Ellis,

I know what you are saying, Garnabby is in his own world when he tries to translate something that he wants to say. He does mean well, he just can't get out of his own way yet. How have you been, Ellis.


R/S

Getting older, too old for this stuff really!

Originally Posted by Ellis

Garnabby, I have no idea of what you said or even if you are asking me to do something. Can anyone translate his post into whatever it is he's trying to say? I'd be happy to reply but I have no idea of what the question was or even if there was a question.

Ellis,

Believe it or not, i'm not a full-time player/commentator of the game. And when i do get around to this, i'm basically wiped-out (tired)... on auto-pilot. (Today, eg, a round trip to a near-by city, after the "day job", to drop off the cat for a $2000 pill to stop his "hyperthyroidism". The pill is radioactive, and the cat has to stay there for a week until the remainder of it (from killing the cancer in his throat) "passes" through his urine. Sure... i know, but i'd have paid $10,000 because of the special bond it shares with my wife. (Though i think the cat just "tolerates" me.)) Furthermore, it's not always easy for me to write/read some of this stuff. As you wrote of yourself, also i was no fan of the english-classes, always got by well on the "analytical virtues"... but have since learned of the their importance, and find myself ever-playing catch up in that department. (I still think the french lessons were a waste of time, mostly because the best way to learn an other language has to be by just "going there". Anyway, that's certainly the only way to pick up on all the nuances, idioms, puns, and the like.)

Getting back to your first question, many others have, admittedly, found many of my posts unintelligible. Here're a couple of recent "favorites" of mine:

1. (This thread was recently deleted over there because that guy's "bot" was a failure? So, i guess that BTC isn't the only forum deleting a lot of posts.)


Re: Proof of my baccarat BOT making me 50 units EVERY DAY
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2009, 08:12:15 PM »
Reply Quote
Quote: Sent by GARNabby on August 31, 2009, 10:59:04 AM



I have found that the only thing even offering to travel to their own casinos to see it in person gets is being called a "dork".


Darmaid replied,

I have read this line of wording 5 times and I still cant understand what your saying.

LOL


2. My Improved System Never Failed 5 Million Spins - www.RouletteForum.net Roulette System Forum .

Don't blame the messenger, i guess. AND DON'T FALL FOR ELLIS' "PLOYS": JUST BECAUSE YOU, the reader, CAN'T UNDERSTAND SOMETHING DOESN'T NECESSARILY MAKE THAT THING WRONG, NOR HIM RIGHT.



Asfaras the drift of my post to you, i guess that comes down to some relationship between deleting real-time conversations, and that feeling one gets after any big loss... like saying to yourself, "Why did i do that, that couldn't have happened, or maybe if i just don't think about it it will go away?" YOU JUST CAN'T DELETE CASINO-LOSSES LIKE YOU CAN A "THREAD".

************************************************** ****

Something about that ACqueen post just popped into my mind. Didn't she (?) write she is some sort of pro? And only a few months after her replies on the GG, to Archer's questioning of her claim of having gone over all of your private-forum material, signing up, etc, all in one week (, to then attest to its workability in the casinos)? Let's see if i can locate that thread... yes, here it is at Gambler's Glen Message Boards : Baccarat Message Board : win@baccarat , and look, under the alias "iwinbaccarat". (At least when i use an alias, it's for some good reason.) Other good threads near-by include Gambler's Glen Message Boards : Baccarat Message Board : Ellis Strikes Back , and Gambler's Glen Message Boards : Baccarat Message Board : In Defense of Ellis? .

************************************************** *****


Now, getting to your last question, "A really wild guess is that you are basically saying that Baccarat is a random 50/50 game plus commission and therefore can't be beat." Baccarat is nearly a 50-50 game; and one which could perhaps (normally and enjoyably) be beatable by simultaneously employing many "advanced" methods, only beginning with the likes of some modifications to the basic card-counting methods (of blackjack).

And as i already wrote in one of my last replies here, there really isn't by definition any basic strategy for baccarat. (I could post a thread of mine from the GG about the futility of "triggers", etc, etc, but you'll just have to do some more of your own research on that.) Bj was worth a percent back in Thorpe's day, but a break-even game (at best) today, regardless how well one plays. (I really wasn't sure of that last statement until recently, after some more of my own research into some of the bj-boards. "Dimwits", in my own opinion of course.)

And someone really ought to put the "taste" of that thread by Katweezel back on Sonny's "plate"... as i was "moved" to the "voodoo section" there for only mentioning the usefulness of betting progressions (, while Sonny didn't even say "boo" about the Wizard). But that would be to perhaps start another "war", of which will have to wait, at least for the right time.

Originally Posted by now here

Ellis,

I know what you are saying, Garnabby is in his own world when he tries to translate something that he wants to say. He does mean well, he just can't get out of his own way yet. How have you been, Ellis.


R/S

Hi ez, hope you're doing well at the casinos lately.

Why would anyone want to "get out of his/her own way" (even if possible), when we could each "be our ways"?

Well now, see we agree on something already: Cats and dimwits. I have 4. aaah cats I mean. I retired from formal work back in 92, But I remember the stress levels. Was a Plant Mgr twice for a total of 11 years. They say the life expectancy of a Plant Mgr. is 6 months.

Actually Thorp concluded a 6% advantage right after he completed his BS math which was a lot more complex than the BS it evolved to today. But Uston proved the 1% almost immediately afterward which perplexed Thorp. Even then the cards weren't random which accounted for the missing 5%.

Since Thorp, BJ math by lesser (I can't bring myself to call them mathematicians) guys was abysmal. These guys, none of whom played, were so ridiculous it has taught me to look askance at ALL gambling math and rely solely on actual recorded casino statistics as the MIT team did.

I've personally met literally thousands of card counters and have yet to find a single one who is ahead net after expenses at the year end. I've played with hundreds of them and found their play just as abysmal, compared to my own, as the mathematicians that spawned them including both Uston and Patterson. At least those two played. And all those BJ gurus started out as my heros. But I soon found out that what they think happens in a BJ game is NOT at all what really happens. I suspect some of the folks here have found the same.

Similar findings with Bac. My statistics demonstrate that only one in a 1000 is a year end winner after expenses. So we are in agreement 99.9%. Of course there are the 1 out of ten who say they win but it turns out they just don't know how to count their money.

So yep, we have a lot of common ground you didn't know about. THAT is where we should start.